X6 and Adobe CMM

Thank you guys for your replies! Currently we use Windows XP and thinking if it's worth upgrading to Windows 7, either 32 or 64 bit.

bahnsen said:

Thank you guys for your replies! Currently we use Windows XP and thinking if it's worth upgrading to Windows 7, either 32 or 64 bit.

Windows 7 is definitely worth the upgrade. but I would suggest Windows 7 Ultimate (64-bit). The other  versions have a few limitations. Accepted that there are a few software that aren't 64-bit ready yet, but whats stopping us being ready for them?

Windows 64-bit and CorelDRAW 64-bit is the best combo I have had in years. The scanning doesn't work, Adobe CMM doesn't work, as they are still not 64-bit ready, but eventually they will be and I don't want to be left out :)

If you try and compare COrelDRAW X5 vs X6, toolset-wise, they are basically the same, but performance-wise it's a whole lot better. Its the first 64-bit release, so we should accept that there will be a ton of new bugs.

For me the 64-bit version and the enhanced AI export were the deciding factors to purchase X6.  I'll live with the bugs till Corel fixes them:) They eventually do.

Just my point-of-view :)

suku said:

Adobe CMM doesn't work,

I seek enlightenment, why is that important to you?

David Milisock said:

Adobe CMM doesn't work,

 

I seek enlightenment, why is that important to you?

[/quote]

 

Most of my work is delivered to clients who ask for the final artwork to be delivered in AI format. I believe these people either have AI, or work with other people who do. The Adobe CMM obviously is the default color engine component for all the Adobe products and as it openly available too, it is my attempt at maintaining a common color workflow between CorelDRAW and AI. Hence my need for Adobe CMM to work.

Please note, I am perfectly happy to use the default Microsoft ICM CMM at the moment. If and when there is a 64-bit  Adobe CMM released I will definitely consider a switch.

suku said:

I believe these people either have AI, or work with other people who do. The Adobe CMM obviously is the default color engine component for all the Adobe products and as it openly available too, it is my attempt at maintaining a common color workflow between CorelDRAW and AI. Hence my need for Adobe CMM to work.

Understandable, however the default color engine for Adobe users (and they have no choice) is ACE not Adobe CMM.  The engines have slight differences, examples are  BPC default and how they use type four profiles.

You are right, ... ACE being the full color engine, while CMM is the module. The CMM was released so users could achieve consistent color workflows using a common CMM. This being a need while working with non-Adobe products and required to deliver in Adobe formats, also retaining color consistency. To my limited knowledge, the Adobe CMM is the closest possible solution.

Then, there is the embedded color profile feature, but I have not tested color matches with this feature, though I invariably embed color profile in all my files. I might sound paranoid about final output results. But, trust me, when the colors don't come out as expected, its your worst nightmare!! :)

Regarding changing the default engine, Adobe does allow to change the Color management if the user so wishes. The option to do so lies under Edit->Color Settings.

suku said:

To my limited knowledge, the Adobe CMM is the closest possible solution.

 You are correct as long as you understand the limitations.

suku said:

Regarding changing the default engine, Adobe does allow to change the Color management if the user so wishes. The option to do so lies under Edit->Color Settings.

I understand this but Adobe CMM and ACE are not the same color engine and interface differently, you'll see this with a system that have Adobe products loaded as well as the Adobe CMM, when you go to choose your color engine even Adobe products see the Adobe CMM as a different engine.  With that being said if cross application color conversion accuracy is super critical then I do suggest the Adobe CMM but make sure it is utilizing the black pint compensation just as those who use Adobe products and the ACE (Adobe Color Engine) do. You still will see some slight differences between ACE and Adobe CMM conversions.  Adobe CMM only gives limited Type 4 profile support in Windows XP, in Vista and Windows 7 there are issues with converting the display from ICC to WCS as these operating systems support ICC but to all and any device that is native WCS as the OS display is then there is another conversion to WCS.

I totally gave up on the MAC and Adobe color engines some time ago and use Windows and WCS only and have never regretted it.  My main reasoning for this is that first Windows is just vastly superior and the color conversions using WCS are just better and to be blunt the extreme incompetance of almost all Adobe users sickens me.

Hello David,

Firstly I must thank you for taking the time and effort you have put in to explain this so clearly. After reading your post, I checked with the Adobe products and did in fact see the options for both ACE and the CMM separately. I should say I was definitely taken aback when I found this out. Obviously it was a misconception of mine about the CMM, unfortunately due to my programming background, I tend to see an Engine and a Module differently, and made the assumption that the module was to be wired  to the engine. Along those lines the separate release of the module all made sense. But after reading your last post, understandably, your grasp of the subject being a whole lot more comprehensive than mine..., why Adobe would have two separate color management systems is beyond me.

On a more practical basis, most Adobe user to whom I eventually send most of my work are using either ACE or Adobe CMM. Hence my choice to use the Adobe CMM solution. But now, following your lead, I have already switched over to the Microsoft WCS, and hopefully there is no looking back for me too!!

I will take it even further and push the Adobe guys I work with to switch too. That would be a win-win situation for me :) Thank you for sharing your knowledge on the subject. Now I know just a little bit more!!

suku said:

I will take it even further and push the Adobe guys I work with to switch too.

Adobe is really behind the curve in terms of Color Management, first no 64 bit Adobe CMM, next Black Point Compensation (Adobes Default setting) is not ICC compliant, then Illustrators black conversion during rasterization is just plain wrong, NO WCS support.  The list goes on and on unfortunately those stuck with Adobes more serious issue have a solution, if you love and must have your Photoshop andf print to a non-postscript device save your files as TIFF, open them in Photo-PAINT 64 bit use WCS and print using Cannons full WCS support.