I write this message for all corel users. In my company i use corel and i use creative suite cs5 for one year and creative CC for one month. Adobe have a grate products but i think there are a lot of programs and one persone can't use all. I find my corel x4 more quickley than illustrator/indesign cc 64 bit. I spend one day for paginate eight pages with illustrator and three hours with Corel. I studies many hours indesign and illustrator but i think almost people have requirement that adobe promotes, it's only a business move. I hope Corel continue to developer this software with this policy and best each distribution. A good graphic using adobe but does not have the ideas in head will never make big plans!!
Tomasi Matttia said:I hope Corel continue to developer this software with this policy and best each distribution.
I use CDR from 2008 and in my opinion as i saw, Corel not invest in cdr developing much. From version x4 i saw some changes ,but not big changes. Only the character formating and the color management are changed, in rest just modified. Export and pdf problems appears in x6 like in x4, no free video tutorials to understand color management in x5, x6 ,CorelDraw masters not handle professional the serious problems like eps exporting or pdf publishing, or the bugs ,they reject all or handle indifferent ,they do not like the criticism :) etc... In graphic design industry (professional print companys) as i saw Adobe products are more preferably.
x4 said:Corel not invest in cdr developing much.
Ok, how much have they invested, real numbers please?
What factual information is your opinion based upon?
Not being mean, just real.
Maybe he means, "effort". Not much effort invested. At least, that's how I read it. And I agree with that sentiment. I always have.
KuttyJoe said:Maybe he means, "effort". Not much effort invested. At least, that's how I read it. And I agree with that sentiment. I always have.
Now you got me curious. What did you use to measure "not much effort"? I mean how do you know?
I am asking because I do not recall your name as participating in the creation/testing of x6. I was there throughout and I totally dis agree with your statement. The effort put forward was extreme and extended beyond the normal, countless hours by so many people. I can say no more.
I say the effort was not enough but obviously I can't prove anything. You say the effort was extended and extreme, but obviously, you can't prove anything. It's interesting that you would attempt such an argument when you have no more proof than anyone else. What I do have though is the resulting products. I have experienced them over a period of about 2 decades. I also have competing products. I have all of their starting points so I can see how much they've progressed over time. So what I can measure extremely well is the result of all of their efforts. So what I focus on is the thing that matters. The result. You can talk all you want about somebody's efforts and accuse people of personal attacks. But what matters to people who spend money and buy products is the quality of the product they've bought.
If you want to talk about effort, you should look at the last 20 years. Look at where CorelDraw Suite was then and look at where it is today. Look at where Adobe Photoshop and Illustrator was 20 years ago and where they are today. Then you can say something realistic about effort.
Neither I, nor you can determine what Adobe and Corel developers have been doing with their time. What we can both see easily though is the result of their efforts. That's really what matters.
KuttyJoe said: If you want to talk about effort, you should look at the last 20 years. Look at where CorelDraw Suite was then and look at where it is today. Look at where Adobe Photoshop and Illustrator was 20 years ago and where they are today. Then you can say something realistic about effort.
I wonder why "20 years" and not othe date, btw I will accept this date. 20 years ago, Adobe was a big company around the world, after develop the industry-standard language for printer: Postscript, and the PS and EPS file format, and there's not any other alternative. Also, Adobe develop the Type1 and Type 3 fonts, and the TrueType fonts, Adobe Photoshop was the most used software for image editing. (I'm not sure if it was 2.5 or 3.0 at this date) On the contrary, Illustrator still has not popularyty, under Mac the most used software was Aldus PageMaker and Aldus Freehand, Adobe said that the programs should be sold individually, it was not professional to develop a suite and things such as a Welcome screen or a Propierty bar was childish.
20 years ago, Corel (a small canadian company) launched CorelDRAW 4.0, adding new features such as multipage files (up to 999 pages) but the program has several bugs. It was the worstt and slowest version ever. After years of success, version 4.0 was a big step back. The prnt preview was enable by default when print, and it was very slow and it was not possible to disable it. Each previoius versions introduced a big amount of great features, but version 4 only add a few changes. The initial release has several problems with color separation (ie, the black output as 4 inks) and was useless until the service pack Still no success with Mac version.
20 years after, Adobe is still the industry standard based on the Postscript language, and still there's not alternative to this language. The PDF becomes a standard and replaces PS and EPS as the most used exchange files. All their programs has now a Welcome screen and Propierty bar, and now they sold their programs as a Suite. Photoshop is still the most used software for image editing After the purchase of Aldus and Macromedia, and the elimination of Freehand, Fireworks and others, Adobe is the only option in Mac. Although after the purchase of Macromedia (Dreamweaver, Flash, etc.) has a stranglehold on web design, has experienced severe economic crises in recent years, having to make several massive layoffs and redistribution of employees, so was forced to release interim versions (CS5.5) and shorten the time to market from 24 to 18 months. Recently changed its policy (Creative Suite to Creative Cloud), based exclusively on online subscription system.
20 years after, Corel has grown significantly in recent years, it has bought Micrografx, Metacreations, U-lead and several more companies, expanding its list of programs: Painter, VideoStudio, Designer (now CorelDRAW Technical suite), PaintShop Pro, AfterShot, CorelCAD, WordPerfect (Quattro Pro, Presentations, etc), PDF Fusion, WinDVD, Winzip, etc.offering a wide variety of solutions. Corel was acquired by Vector and then returned to the stock market. and has increased more than ten times the number of users in the last few years, becoming one of the most popular software companies around the world. The latest versions (X5, X6) have been the best sellers in its history and that have had greater success.
Ariel said:I wonder why "20 years" and not othe date, btw I will accept this date. 20 years ago, Adobe was a big company around the world, after develop the industry-standard language for printer: Postscript, and the PS and EPS file format, and there's not any other alternative.
I'm not talking about Adobe vs Corel. I was talking about Illustrator and Photoshop, vs CorelDraw Suite. I was talking about what kind of development we've seen of these products over 20 years. Adobe vs Corel is a different conversation.
Hi KuttyJoe,
KuttyJoe said: I was talking about what kind of development we've seen of these products over 20 years
Come on fill out the application and be a part of history as opposed to observing it. You can make a real difference if you want.
If I do observe it, I will do a far better job at observing than you claim to have done. The difference I'm making is daring to bluntly speak the truth while others have merely picked a team to support, no matter what.
KuttyJoe said:I'm not talking about Adobe vs Corel. I was talking about Illustrator and Photoshop, vs CorelDraw Suite. I was talking about what kind of development we've seen of these products over 20 years. Adobe vs Corel is a different conversation.
Yes, that's different. 20 years ago, Corel buys PhotoPaint from Z-soft, for having a good alternative to Photoshop. But years later, Corel buys PaintShopPro and focuses all their efforts to the new program. If you compare the evolution of PaintShopPro from the past years to the present, you will notice the difference and a lot of features (including the dark gray interface of the newest Photoshop versions). I know, Photoshop is still the most used software for iamge retouch, but for most users, PaintShop pro has the same features. And PhotoPaint is just a part of CorelDRAW for photo-editing, the company don't want to compete againt itself.
And yes, both Photoshop and Illustrator have grown significantly, but also CorelDRAW is not more a simple program for basic drawings. Now you can develop a magazine, a book, and a lot of works with CorelDRAW only. The kind of drawings that you can do now with CorelDRAW is very, very different to the jobs of 20 years ago, including time and effort. Yes, still can do it more and still should do it better, but if I remember the clipart of CorelDRAW 3 / 4 / 5 with the present, i notice a big difference.
Ariel said: I'm not talking about Adobe vs Corel. I was talking about Illustrator and Photoshop, vs CorelDraw Suite. I was talking about what kind of development we've seen of these products over 20 years. Adobe vs Corel is a different conversation. Yes, that's different. 20 years ago, Corel buys PhotoPaint from Z-soft, for having a good alternative to Photoshop. But years later, Corel buys PaintShopPro and focuses all their efforts to the new program. If you compare the evolution of PaintShopPro from the past years to the present, you will notice the difference and a lot of features (including the dark gray interface of the newest Photoshop versions). I know, Photoshop is still the most used software for iamge retouch, but for most users, PaintShop pro has the same features. And PhotoPaint is just a part of CorelDRAW for photo-editing, the company don't want to compete againt itself. And yes, both Photoshop and Illustrator have grown significantly, but also CorelDRAW is not more a simple program for basic drawings. Now you can develop a magazine, a book, and a lot of works with CorelDRAW only. The kind of drawings that you can do now with CorelDRAW is very, very different to the jobs of 20 years ago, including time and effort. Yes, still can do it more and still should do it better, but if I remember the clipart of CorelDRAW 3 / 4 / 5 with the present, i notice a big difference. [/quote] I appreciate your level headed response. And I agree that CorelDraw has fared better, just as you agree that Photo-Paint hasn't. With Photo-Paint, it's a really clear case of next to no development on the part of Corel since version 8. With CorelDraw, there's a lot more room for dispute. I would say that CorelDraw has always been a more ambitious undertaking than Illustrator. But I would also say that Corel hasn't been all that successful at some of the other things that it is supposed to be able to do. For example, page layout. CorelDraw is infamous for corrupting documents once they reach a certain file size. So you make your "book" with CorelDraw if you like, but it just might crash and you'll find that you can no longer open that document. It happened to me back in the nineties when I was making graphic catalogs for my own business, and I still see reports of it happening during this year! It sounds great that Corel can do varied things, but the quality and reliability will sometimes make you wish you'd just used a real page layout program. Still, CorelDraw has features like bar code creation, labels and business card, text merging, etc that Illustrator doesn't even attempt. I have to give Corel for those and others even if those are features that Corel implemented during the nineties.
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I appreciate your level headed response. And I agree that CorelDraw has fared better, just as you agree that Photo-Paint hasn't. With Photo-Paint, it's a really clear case of next to no development on the part of Corel since version 8. With CorelDraw, there's a lot more room for dispute. I would say that CorelDraw has always been a more ambitious undertaking than Illustrator. But I would also say that Corel hasn't been all that successful at some of the other things that it is supposed to be able to do. For example, page layout. CorelDraw is infamous for corrupting documents once they reach a certain file size. So you make your "book" with CorelDraw if you like, but it just might crash and you'll find that you can no longer open that document. It happened to me back in the nineties when I was making graphic catalogs for my own business, and I still see reports of it happening during this year! It sounds great that Corel can do varied things, but the quality and reliability will sometimes make you wish you'd just used a real page layout program. Still, CorelDraw has features like bar code creation, labels and business card, text merging, etc that Illustrator doesn't even attempt. I have to give Corel for those and others even if those are features that Corel implemented during the nineties.