Hello, that's my first post. This forum seems to have a lot of experienced people, and I am really in need here. I work on Mutoh Falcon II in which I use Pantone solid Coated pallete (from X3). I made 2 printings with this pallete, and done it with two diffrent printer profiles. Now when I got 2 pallets on textile, I can easily look how will every color from pallete look like after job. So I can very precise make my projects, and the clients are used to my colors. Unfortunatly, during last 3 years, many things have changes, and also I am getting more and more new files, which X3 can't properly manage, open and import. Also it can't use full potential of my machine, so I decided to move on to X5. Now after moving I am shocked about how diffrently it treats all graphhic. It don't have same pallete of Pantone C. Every Pantone has slightly / significant diffrence in separative colors, so my old Pantone 185, or 485 now on my printer looks compleatly diffrent! This cannot be happening. I lost 50m of fabric becuase EuropeUnion flags were printet in diffrent blue color.... Now I tried to help myslef, but I have poor knowledge about colors profile. During my little investigation, I saw that there is a way to get my old pantone. I have imported my old pallete, which is in cpl file. I can open it via X5 pallete editor. Than I need to thick little box which says "Treat as separation colors" - than the name of for example Pantone 485C goes away, but it's place is took by CMYK parameters, which are correct with old CMYK parameters in Corel X3. But by doing this there are two problems. First and worst is that it would take me years to change by my hand all those pantone colors. Second, also very annoying is that after doing so - Corel X5 stops to find colors which I want when I type their name. It used to be that I was clicking on object, on it's color twice, than little window was poping, I clicked there (Colors/Models/Pallets) Pallets, and there was my normal Pantone(R) solid coated. Than I just type 4... and 485C was already shown. Than just Enter and done. Color set. Now after changing the pallet to separative colors, I am loosing "names" and getting just CMYK color name. To be precise, in Corel X3 it looks like this :
And this is in X5:
, so please tell me WHY!? :) Who made such great fail. I'd love to have my old colors in new version, because it is so much faster in opening and working on files. But color diffrences are not accaptable. And this is why I spent more than 700$, and now still I'm using old soft. Please help me out.
Maybe this will help You understand something more, pictures of settings in X3 and 5.
A short answer: you must use a different color profile to have good results. That's all. You do't nned to find old libraries, replace palette or nothing. The "old palettes" has changed because Pantone company change values, but you can use the last color settings with the appropriate color profile without problem,
As far I see, on X3 you don't have a calibrate color profile. Almost all is "generic", and that means that you never calibrate it. Perhaps it works fine, but you don't know what's your real color profile.For example, if you're using Perceptual rendering, CMYK ICC Coated Fogra 27 o Fogra 39, etc. On X5 you have several values that I don't know why you are using, such as Grayscale with Dot Gain according to Gamma 2.2.Also, you're using RGB color profile, and output as CMYK, so I believe you must use CMYK instead
If you change the last option (Spot color definition) fromLab to CMYK, you wil have better values when change Pantone to CMYK
You're great man! Thicking this only option "Lab->Cmyk" solves my problem compleatly. To the rest of your message - I do know that I never used any profile, and that my profiles are bad, and goind with those generic profile isn't good. And moving further - I cannot belive my eyes when designing graphic, but on my brain which remebers which color will look best in every and each of those projects that I work on. But this is how it is in my company, and now it's too late to change everything upside down. Not only i work on this machine, I don't have only Mutoh, but also Mimaki etc. Here we always relay on those pallets that we have printed, on fabric. This are our color-tables, and to be hones as far as it goes I got used to it. Maybe some day when I'll be more experienced I will try to change that, but I already can hear my co-worker (in my mind) who says "why changeing something that works!" :)
Thank You one more time, I will update this topic if I'll encounter any other problems.
Yes, I know that, and I'm using it (new pantone). We're also talking about swithching into this Lab thing. Now I've got another question / problem. I'd like to print Pantone Plus pallete, but for old pallete, we got pdf file from Pantone website. Now it's hard to find PDF file which would have all colors on one page. Also using built-in macro for creating color swaches, will creat couple of pages. Is there any way to make this macro to put all swaches on one page, or maybe in fixed rectangular area ? I need to fit it into 159cm. I'd be very greatfull.
It handles PDF well, but I never tried feeding him with PDF consisting of more than one page at same time. I use PosterPrint and HPS RIP. Both are more simple than heavy-multi photoshop like applications. They're giving just simple ways of croping, scaling etc. I will report to my colegue and repet here what he got.
edit: also one more question, in X3 we've got option to proof colors, which I have bind'ed to "Ctrl+/", and by doing so, all graphics on screen were having less saturation - almost same like on fabric after print. It was good to show clients, that "this is color you gave us, but keep in mind you'll get this "Ctrl+/" and POW! he sees what he'll get. Now in X5, there's also such option, and I also have binded it, to preserve old habbits, but this option don't give any effect. I'm sure it can be set somewhere, but I'm afraid it will need some profile to change to. And from X3 I cannot take it, because I just don's see that option to "show" which profile you're (corel) use for on-screen conversion....
Brute-Fish said:After asking a true color professional,
Thanks for the plug but I think it's more like a true professional color student.
Thank You for those wise advices, indeed they helped us out. Now there is another problem regarding colors. No matter what option I will thick during export to TiF file, (which sometimes is faster and more efficent than EPS) in PosterPrint the imported TIF is always in black and white.... I can check options as I like, CMYK, RGB, include profile or not include. Nothing helps. All bitmaps generated in TIF in X5 are always BW. If I would take it into PSCS2, and than just save'as again to same tif, in poster print it will have colors as needed. Also sometimes when importing bitmaps into corel, little window popsup, with info that there is not profile included, and how should it proceed. Now in PS, there is great option which would sound like "DO NOTHING", where in X5 there is only "DO SOMETHING - that is, include such profile, or diffrent, but not to "leave as it is" " Look pictures.
X5 - CDR to TIF export window
Photoshop CS2
COREL x5:
Please forgive my questions, but going from one software to another can be sometimes more difficult that it seems, apparently... :)
Also I switched to ENG version, so it all be more understandable for you to help us (we worked in ENG only in X3, so no problemo. Here is our general color settings, I think BW problem has something to do with the right side of this little window :
HPS said:
HPS said: Also sometimes when importing bitmaps into corel, little window popsup, with info that there is not profile included, and how should it proceed. Now in PS, there is great option which would sound like "DO NOTHING", where in X5 there is only "DO SOMETHING - that is, include such profile, or diffrent, but not to "leave as it is"
The right side explain all the warnings you see. Just disable all warnings
Ok what version of Poster Chop?
I use I use Production House. Maintain Aspect Ration seems turned off as anti aliasing.
CS2 is doing it wrong you cannot open or viewe\ a file without using some color profile of some type. Adobe just lies to you and diplays it in some profile.
Maybe, but in the end, CS2 makes Tiffs in color, where X5 does them in BW. Any help with that, please?